Imagination and unfolding reality

Many today struggle to perceive spiritual reality. But might we be passing through a stage in the evolution of human awareness?

In this dialogue, Rupert Sheldrake and I discuss a recent conference that addressed this question. It was inspired by the ideas of Owen Barfield, whom I’ve written about in my new book, A Secret History of Christianity.

Barfield argued the task is not just to recover old ways of perceiving nature and the divine but requires a radical transformation of ourselves that can be troubling and even tragic. We ask about the role of service and discerning the imagination in this process and how we might learn to relate afresh to consciousnesses and intelligences in the world around us.

All the talks from the conference are available online at

The many previous discussions between myself and Rupert Sheldrake can be found on youtube, streamed, Spotify, iHeartRadio, as a playlist on SoundCloud, and on iTunes.